Disaster, unless it can be fixed:
I opened a Microsoft Word file (a carefully formatted bibliography).
I worked on it for a while in Nisus then saved without changing the name or anything. Then closed the file
Next day, I tried opening the same file with Nisus, but nothing happened. Wouldn't open. Nothing. If I put the rtf extension on the file name, it just opened as a blank
I tried to open with Word 2004, got the dialogue asking what to convert from. It would only accept text, and then opened as text, with no formatting.
I saved it as a text file, which both Nisus and Word can open. But the formatting has completely gone. This is hours of work down the drain.
What has happened? Is there any way to save that file?
I've just experimented with copies of other Word files. The same thing happens: if I save in Nisus without changing the name, I get a file which Nisus can't open, and Word only opens in text. This is DANGEROUS. Is this documented anywhere?
Meanwhile, can I get my formatting back? I have file buddy, if that can help
Can't re-open file
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Anne Cuneo
- Posts: 164
- Joined: 2004-09-23 02:15:46
- Location: Switzerland
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I am not sure this is exactly the same bug (for I suppose it is one), but something similar happened to me with Nisus classic files since updating to 10.3.7. I open a Nisus Classic file from NWE. When I save it, it becomes an unreadable document. I have opened and closed Nisus Classic files from NWE, in order to copy something for instance, if I changed nothing they remained unchanged Nisus Classic Files. Now they go astray. Can anybody explain this?
Because it means that I lost not only formatting, but the text altogether.
Because it means that I lost not only formatting, but the text altogether.
Anne
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Anne Cuneo
- Posts: 164
- Joined: 2004-09-23 02:15:46
- Location: Switzerland
- Contact:
Re: Can't re-open file
I've tried to do this with some Windows Word files I've got laying around and I cannot reproduce your problem, NWX was able to open them again after I'd made a some (simple) changes to them and saved them using "Save" rather than "Save As..." in NWX (which is I assume what you're doing). Both the original open and the reopening can take a long time with large and/or complexly formatted Word files of course.TimK wrote:Disaster, unless it can be fixed:
I opened a Microsoft Word file (a carefully formatted bibliography).
I worked on it for a while in Nisus then saved without changing the name or anything. Then closed the file
Next day, I tried opening the same file with Nisus, but nothing happened. Wouldn't open. Nothing. If I put the rtf extension on the file name, it just opened as a blank...
However there is a point you need to be aware of that may be related to your problem -- NWX does not really support exporting/writing files in native Word format, only reading/importing native Word files. When you use NWX to save a file as Word (.doc) format what it REALLY does is save it as an RTF file with a .doc extension. It does NOT convert it to the native Word file format as you probably expect. This is technically "legal" as Word has no problems handling RTF files disguised with .doc extensions (at least on Windows, I don't know about Mac Word).
So when you open a native Word file with NWX it converts it into RTF format to display and edit it and then if you simply "Save" it with the same name it overwrites the original native Word file with the new RTF version keeping the .doc extension. It sounds like in your case something has become corrupted in this process. I suggest you always save imported Word files as <somenewname>.doc or maybe <sameoldname>.rtf just in case, else you risk the loss of your original Word file due to conversion problems.
As far as I know Nisus have never really documented this behaviour anywhere (marketing reasons I assume) and I really think they should. It's something users need to know as it can cause problems if there are problems in the Word->RTF translation process.
Hi:
First of all, if you can, please send the file your are having problems with to us by choosing "Report a Bug..." in the Nisus Writer Express Help menu. We will take a look at the file and then we can hopefully fix this issue for you.
Also, saving a DOC file using the RTF format is completely supported by Word. Word just reads a file like this just like any other RTF file. As far as we know, there are no problems caused by saving a file like this and opening it in Word. (Word Mac 2004 even uses this technique to save certain DOC formats.)
-Charles
First of all, if you can, please send the file your are having problems with to us by choosing "Report a Bug..." in the Nisus Writer Express Help menu. We will take a look at the file and then we can hopefully fix this issue for you.
Also, saving a DOC file using the RTF format is completely supported by Word. Word just reads a file like this just like any other RTF file. As far as we know, there are no problems caused by saving a file like this and opening it in Word. (Word Mac 2004 even uses this technique to save certain DOC formats.)
-Charles
Charles Jolley
Nisus Software, Inc.
Nisus Software, Inc.
That particular file has been trashed, as it was useless. However, the same thing happens with any word file that I open, then save. Do I need to do that and send you the results?
I know that if I open a word file, then save it, it is saved in rtf, but I did not realise that I had to change the name of the file when I did it. I think this should be documented.
By the way, I'm sorry I did not respond to your message sooner, but I was waiting for notification that a reply was posted. I clicked the right box below, but have got no notification. In fact, I don't think I ever get notification. Something's wrong there.
I know that if I open a word file, then save it, it is saved in rtf, but I did not realise that I had to change the name of the file when I did it. I think this should be documented.
By the way, I'm sorry I did not respond to your message sooner, but I was waiting for notification that a reply was posted. I clicked the right box below, but have got no notification. In fact, I don't think I ever get notification. Something's wrong there.
OK, here is what happens:
1) If the original file is Word format, and has a .doc extension, then when I open it in Nisus, then save it, all that happens is that the icon changes to a Nisus icon. This can then be opened again in Word or Nisus, no problem. Although I'm told that Nisus can only save to rtf, I was surprised to find that the info still has it as a Word format file. (Word properties shows it as a Nisus document, in Word Format). But, for me as a user, there is no problem.
2) However, if there is NO .doc extension on the word file, then trouble ensues. If I open this in Nisus and then just save it, the icon changes to a blank generic. If I open it with Word, then all of the formatting is gone. It appears to have become plain text, and the Word properties says it is a Nisus writer document, although it doesn't say what format. However, I cannot open it at all with Nisus: if I click it nothing happens.
I've tried this over and over again, with different files, and also the same file with and without the 'doc extension and the same thing always happens. Obviously, one must be sure to 'save as' and not simply save. I can't find this documented anywhere, and I think it should be.
1) If the original file is Word format, and has a .doc extension, then when I open it in Nisus, then save it, all that happens is that the icon changes to a Nisus icon. This can then be opened again in Word or Nisus, no problem. Although I'm told that Nisus can only save to rtf, I was surprised to find that the info still has it as a Word format file. (Word properties shows it as a Nisus document, in Word Format). But, for me as a user, there is no problem.
2) However, if there is NO .doc extension on the word file, then trouble ensues. If I open this in Nisus and then just save it, the icon changes to a blank generic. If I open it with Word, then all of the formatting is gone. It appears to have become plain text, and the Word properties says it is a Nisus writer document, although it doesn't say what format. However, I cannot open it at all with Nisus: if I click it nothing happens.
I've tried this over and over again, with different files, and also the same file with and without the 'doc extension and the same thing always happens. Obviously, one must be sure to 'save as' and not simply save. I can't find this documented anywhere, and I think it should be.
I've just discovered something else:
If I open a word formatted file that hasn't got a .doc extension with Nisus, and save it, then the icon changes to blank. If I then try to open that file with Nisus, then nothing happens.
HOWEVER: if Nisus is not actually running when I try to open the file, then Nisus starts, and then opens a document. However it is blank and untitled.
If I open a word formatted file that hasn't got a .doc extension with Nisus, and save it, then the icon changes to blank. If I then try to open that file with Nisus, then nothing happens.
HOWEVER: if Nisus is not actually running when I try to open the file, then Nisus starts, and then opens a document. However it is blank and untitled.
First, an explanation about DOC files: A "Word document" is a file ending with the ".doc" extension. This file may contain binary data or RTF data. Words itself will sometimes save Word documents in both ways. So when you save a Word document in Nisus Writer, it contains RTF but it is still a Word document.
Second, if you remove the extension, the only way applications can tell what kind of file it is is with the Mac type and creator codes. These are not nearly as reliable in Mac OS X as they were in Classic so you can sometimes get the kinds of problems you talk about where the files are not recognized for what they are when an application tries to open them.
The best way to deal with this is to always use the file extension on your files. Files saved in Nisus can end in ".rtf" or ".doc". Either one will make it work properly in Nisus and Word.
-Charles
Second, if you remove the extension, the only way applications can tell what kind of file it is is with the Mac type and creator codes. These are not nearly as reliable in Mac OS X as they were in Classic so you can sometimes get the kinds of problems you talk about where the files are not recognized for what they are when an application tries to open them.
The best way to deal with this is to always use the file extension on your files. Files saved in Nisus can end in ".rtf" or ".doc". Either one will make it work properly in Nisus and Word.
-Charles
Charles Jolley
Nisus Software, Inc.
Nisus Software, Inc.
Well, sure, now I know that Nisus requires a .doc extension. However, macintosh does not require a .doc extension, and there has never been any reason to have one.
I don't think you can just shrug this off. Lots of people have Word format files that don't have the extension, and therefore it should be clearly documented that Nisus requires the extension. This is a VERY dangerous shortcoming.
Actually, Nisus SHOULD be able to tell if a file is word-formatted whether it has an extension or not, so I consider this to be a bug, and a serious one.
I don't think you can just shrug this off. Lots of people have Word format files that don't have the extension, and therefore it should be clearly documented that Nisus requires the extension. This is a VERY dangerous shortcoming.
Actually, Nisus SHOULD be able to tell if a file is word-formatted whether it has an extension or not, so I consider this to be a bug, and a serious one.