equation editor recommendations

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counterpt
Posts: 15
Joined: 2008-04-20 13:00:58

equation editor recommendations

Post by counterpt » 2008-04-20 13:33:49

Hello,

I have NWP on intel 10.5.2 mac.

I'm curious what equation editors people recommend.

I have used MathType, but MathType ruins half of the fonts on Leopard (for example the proportional sign and the arrow symbols will randomly insert other symbols in half the fonts after MathType is installed on a fresh Leopard (It took me many reinstalls of Leopard to discover this).

I don't want to use *tex because, as I understand, they output PDFs which after I paste in NWP, I can't copy them back and reedit them later (I want to be able to edit documents later and I don't want to save every single equation as a file). I do love the quality/fonts/look of tex though.

I'm currently using MathMagic. I like it because the installation is drag and drop (same with fonts). But the font's aren't quite standard for example the MMTimes font looks slighly different than Times or any other font. I want to have a standardized look to my documents. Also it's a carbon app and copy pasting certain things (square root symbol then blowing it up) makes things a little jagged and pixelated.

I'm afraid to use MathEQ since it's not a drag a drop install and I don't want to find out it's going to ruin the system fonts (as MathType did) as I don't want to reinstall Leopard again (I teach at a college and I can't ruin my only mac to experiment).

So my question is: What is your advice?
I know it's not a NSP specific question but I am using NSP with it.

Thank you,

LongTermUser
Posts: 25
Joined: 2007-10-31 05:58:12

Post by LongTermUser » 2008-04-24 12:26:16

On the www.livemath.com website you will find the pre-release versions (under weekly builds on the top page) of MathEq, which is 4.08 [U08] which at my urgings have addressed some of the problems with baseline recognition. You have to change some settings. So far it has not harmed my fonts.

counterpt
Posts: 15
Joined: 2008-04-20 13:00:58

Post by counterpt » 2008-04-24 14:11:48

Thanks. I just installed MathEQ. To be honest I don't like it. It's even worse trying to uninstall as it doesn't tell you what fonts it installed and no uninstall directions. It has nonstandard looking square root signs and copying clips off part of the equation. Now I have to spend some time cleaning up after it.

Thanks again.

cyberbryce
Posts: 3
Joined: 2008-02-23 10:26:34

Re: equation editor recommendations

Post by cyberbryce » 2008-04-24 19:02:42

counterpt wrote:Hello,

..

I have used MathType, but MathType ruins half of the fonts on Leopard (for example the proportional sign and the arrow symbols will randomly insert other symbols in half the fonts after MathType is installed on a fresh Leopard (It took me many reinstalls of Leopard to discover this).

I don't want to use *tex because, as I understand, they output PDFs which after I paste in NWP, I can't copy them back and reedit them later (I want to be able to edit documents later and I don't want to save every single equation as a file). I do love the quality/fonts/look of tex though.

...

So my question is: What is your advice?
I know it's not a NSP specific question but I am using NSP with it.

Thank you,
I tend to use LaTeXiT when wordprocessing, but I've used MathType as well. Both MathType and LaTeXiT equations are re-editable via copy and paste. Further, NWP supports LinkBack with LaTeXiT to make re-editing even easier. After saving a document into which you have pasted a LaTeXiT equation, you can double-click on the equation to edit it again. You can use MathType as a visual front-end since it will generate LaTeX that will work in LaTeXiT's "Text" mode (YMMV; I've had no problems with it in Leopard...), and this yields flexibility in case you decide to change strategies later (see below).

It wasn't clear whether exchanging documents with equations with Word users was a concern. Documents containing MathType equations should be exchangeable "as is" with Word users (but I haven't had occasion to try it...).

LongTermUser
Posts: 25
Joined: 2007-10-31 05:58:12

Post by LongTermUser » 2008-04-25 05:10:32

MathEq (old Expressionist) has a great tweeking ability. The square root sign can be adjusted to standard form. I have not had problems with fonts being installed on removed. So far I don't think that it is a worry.

For you settings go to:

Preferences->Copy Prefs->Choose Application->Nisus

Then:

Preferences->Target Prefs->MS Word Prefs->Paste Expressions using in-line->then try Math Axis or other options to see what is best.

Lorenz

counterpt
Posts: 15
Joined: 2008-04-20 13:00:58

Re: equation editor recommendations

Post by counterpt » 2008-04-25 06:47:54

cyberbryce wrote: I tend to use LaTeXiT when wordprocessing, but I've used MathType as well. Both MathType and LaTeXiT equations are re-editable via copy and paste. Further, NWP supports LinkBack with LaTeXiT to make re-editing even easier.
Thank you. I started playing with LaTeXiT. I like it. The services as nice too as you can put math code in NWP and highlight it and do services and convert it to a n equation. It has a strange thing though if you start typing after an inserted equation the baseline for regular NWP characters get goofy (also font gets converted to helvetica).

I used MacTex for the base latex, is that an ok choice?

I know you mention mathtype. Here is the problem I had with mathtype you might want to see if you are affected by the same thing. In leopard, after I installed mathtype, this strange thing happened:
Open the character palette (where you would put symbols). Now try to insert right arrow or proportional sign in a serif font in any program except textedit. (Note we aren't even using mathtype). To me it inserted random characters like square brackets instead of arrow, or therefore sign instead of proportional. This only affected half the fonts (mostly serif fonts). And this happened on a fresh install of leopard. It behaved normally before installing mathype. It misbehaves after so it has to be something mathtype did.

Since I have MathMagic installed and paid for now, I will use that as a frond end to latex but its translator isn't great so I'll have to learn latex!

ps. I couldn't care lass with Word compatibility.

Thank you very much again!

cyberbryce
Posts: 3
Joined: 2008-02-23 10:26:34

Post by cyberbryce » 2008-04-30 20:17:37

Thank you. I started playing with LaTeXiT. I like it. The services as nice too as you can put math code in NWP and highlight it and do services and convert it to a n equation. It has a strange thing though if you start typing after an inserted equation the baseline for regular NWP characters get goofy (also font gets converted to helvetica).
If I recall correctly, LaTeXiT wraps the image in an RTFD stream that encodes the baseline information, but Nisus wouldn't have any way to know that you want to go back to the regular baseline, so that's something we'll have to live with I think. As far as Helvetica goes, that sounds like a bug but I don't know which app is the culprit (I'd guess LaTeXiT -- you might contact the developer; be nice, as it is a gem...).

I used MacTex for the base latex, is that an ok choice?
I think that's not really any special flavor of LaTeX--rather, it's the Mac binary package that's getting actively maintained. I'm happy to report I haven't had any problems attributable to it yet in my occasional use of it.

I know you mention mathtype. Here is the problem I had with mathtype you might want to see if you are affected by the same thing. In leopard, after I installed mathtype, this strange thing happened:
Open the character palette (where you would put symbols). Now try to insert right arrow or proportional sign in a serif font in any program except textedit. (Note we aren't even using mathtype). To me it inserted random characters like square brackets instead of arrow, or therefore sign instead of proportional. This only affected half the fonts (mostly serif fonts). And this happened on a fresh install of leopard. It behaved normally before installing mathype. It misbehaves after so it has to be something mathtype did.
Weird. It sounds like a corrupt font (if so, that's a nasty problem to fix...). I haven't had that problem. Per chance, are you using an Intel machine?

I've had similar problems with MathType for sets of equations. I still find some kind of visual editor indispensable for highly complicated or intricate equations.
Since I have MathMagic installed and paid for now, I will use that as a frond end to latex but its translator isn't great so I'll have to learn latex!
Best of luck! I think the advantage to learning even a little bit of LaTeX is that, not only do you have the use of LaTeXiT for lighter uses but--if you are composing something like a proof with dozens of equations where a standard word processor doesn't work very well--you will be able to switch to LaTeX (say, TeXShop) and do it there.

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